Lunicks / Sal

[Nodd]

So I got a call first thing this morning from my very upset girlfriend, telling me to check a certain post immediately.

For those that saw it, I'm sorry I couldn't get to it quick enough.

I discussed it with my girlfriend and we decided the best course of action would be to ban Lunicks and remove the offending post and signature. Sure, this is a place where we push boundaries of acceptable content now and then, but not to the extremes.

There is little moderation/admin work and rules on the forum, but I feel Lunicks betrayed my trust. Posting images of heavily tortured animals is not tollerated here. I've seen images on tv before and some internet pictures, but nothing anywhere near that bad. It was awful, and has probably scarred me (and others) for life.



I understand that the post in question will have upset quite a few of you. I have currently banned him for a month, but I think it should be a joint decision on the final action to take on this. Sal has been a member for a long time so this is quite uncomfortable..

Do you think the account should be banned for a month, or completely? Or do you feel my actions were too strong, and that he should have been given a warning only?

Please let me know how you feel.

[Strange1]

i dont really know where to start. i feel sal has always had a very abrasive side to him. when you changed his signature he probably posted the offending pictures to get back at you in some way i feel. or he thought it was funny...or something.

i think the way youve handled it so far has been good although im not sure if a month was a little too much. maybe just a week or something. after a month you can easily have found other forums etc. if we want him to come back..and im not sure if we do *shifty eyes* i think a week would be more befitting for his...ermm crimes?

dont understand why he didnt just NSFW and link it like we have done with other not so nice things in the past.

anyways. handled well nodd. well done mate.

[Hudders]

Well I would have stopped short of banning him but it's clear that he needs to be kept on a short leash. I figure his personal problems, (as mentioned elsewhere), might be playing a part in his behaviour.

If you had some kind of reduced-functionality mode you could put people in, (can post text & links but not pictures or videos), this would be a situation where that would be appropriate. I imagine you don't have that functionality currently but it might be worth looking into whether you could implement something similar.

Personally, I've not been scarred for life by the images but I know that, had my girlfriend seen them, she would have been upset and I can see how others might have had the same reaction. Thankfully I think only a small number of people saw them.

For the record, I'd say that those pictures would have some kind of place on this forum under the right circumstances and would need to be linked to with an appropriate warning message rather than just blithely posted as a shock tactic. You don't even get pieces on TV with this kind of content, (even after the watershed), without a warning.

I don't think we need to go as far as to develop a policy on this kind of thing since everyone here is mature enough to realise what is and what isn't appropriate and everyone should listen to everyone else when asked to remove certain images from the site.

That said, it might be appropriate for you to allow someone else to edit posts in an admin role just in case something like this happens again and you aren't available at the time.

[Yali]

Good decision. As something I saw as basically the first thing in the morning, my appetite for breakfast was immediately gone.

I don't think a month is too harsh. On quite a large percentage of forums throughout the internet, it would have resulted in a perma-ban. This also taking into consideration that Sally hasn't exactly got a clean past when it comes to foruming.

I understand that it is a difficult decision to make, especially because it concerns a longtime forum member. However, posting pictures like that is definately not acceptable.

Personally, I feel he has crossed a line that I'll never forgive him for.

So, in short. He's already had some warnings in the past about rude/offensive behaviour. Today shows that he hasn't learnt anything from it. I think we could go on happily without him.

EDIT:
I just keep seeing that picture in my head over and over again..
Imagining it could be one of my cats.... Seriously... Don't ever let him back on the forums....please...

[IronBat]

I agree that what saladin did was wrong and unacceptable, I also agree that some kind of action was needed (I know Yali was VERY upset by the pictures) but at the same time I cant help feeling that we need to be careful about overreacting.

Saladin is a long standing member of the forum, he has always caused problems and controversy but I think that’s just part of who he is. That doesn’t make him a bad person, he has a bit of a different look on things and as strange1 said he comes across as abrasive, but so does ipunk! I reckon that saladin actually gets picked on a bit for being different! I think he gets antagonised and this may cause him to do more stupid things.

I think Nodd abused his powers by changing saladins sig, yeah it was funny but does that justify it? It was a breach in admin/member trust. (This is not an attack on Nodd, he didnt do it out of spite he just didnt think it through.)

I seriously think this forum needs mods again! (I know will just be ignored again). I think this would help take the pressure off Nodd and add a voice of reason back to the forum. Nodd can’t be everywhere all the time.

Sometimes I wonder why I bother to post

[Yali]

Sometimes I wonder why I bother to post

Because work is boring!

[Nodd]

So IronBat, You'd have preferred me to leave his signature of having an adult masturbating over a child?

Hmmm.. I didn't know that was your sort of thing? Personally I think I had a full right to change it to something more "SFW".

Just because you don't know why I change something, doesn't mean it's not a good idea.


+ selecting a mod is not quite as easy as you think. I find it causes frictions in friendship.

[Yali]

So IronBat, You'd have preferred me to leave his signature of having an adult masturbating over a child?

Well... that's reason two for not letting him come back..
Didn't get that part, but I think it's rather nice for people to know that he's made two disturbing unsuitable sigs in a short time..

[Hudders]

So IronBat, You'd have preferred me to leave his signature of having an adult masturbating over a child?

Well... that's reason two for not letting him come back..
Didn't get that part, but I think it's rather nice for people to know that he's made two disturbing unsuitable sigs in a short time..

I think that's an overreaction. It was a picture from badly-drawn webcomic Morning Glory, (and actually I didn't get the impression that it was an adult wanking over a child at all from it). It wasn't as if it was child porn. Let's not get all "think of the children!!" here, we're all guilty of making offensive comments from time to time; nobody ever said that this site was safe for kids.

[Strange1]

oh yeah i remember that. yeah not something very suitable for the forum tbh.

[Nodd]

ok, so there wasn't animation, but I think the message was clear. We don't need walt disney to help us out on this one... lol



I guess the problem is there are no defined rules, and some people think that a penis next to child's face is highly acceptable. Morning Glory content is NSFW. If we "NSFW" hide everything we'd have almost no images on the forum. Stuff on their own topic is ok, but to have something like that as a sig on all topics, it's kinda bad. That way it's a bit easier to avoid NSFW content.

I've been immature and posted a sic toilet image a few times, but it is nowhere near as extreme and offensive as the animal cruelty picture shown by Lunicks. Did IronBat actually see it? He seems a bit too chilled out about the whole thing? Apart from me "overreating". lol. I know of 3 people it affected horribly. I mean, they have been on here ages too, they know of sick goings on... but it was way too far.

[Hudders]

ok, so there wasn't animation, but I think the message was clear. We don't need walt disney to help us out on this one... lol

I guess the problem is there are no defined rules, and some people think that a penis next to child's face is highly acceptable.

I'm just saying a lot of people didn't actually see the offending sig and the way it's being discussed makes it sound a lot worse than it actually was. There was a penis and a child's face involved, yes; but each was at the other end of a banner, the middle being taken up with the Morning Glory logo itself. Add to that the fact that the penis was even more crudely drawn than you normally find graffitied on pub toilet doors...

Maybe I'm overanalysing this; but I just wanted to point out that it wasn't as offensive as people who haven't even seen it are assuming. I agree that it wasn't suitable and I think you did the right thing in changing it the way you did, (the sig you changed it to amused me), but I think in the grand scheme of things it pales considerably in comparison.

Rapidly this is turning into a witch-hunt which I don't think is fair, especially considering the fact that he's not able to be here to defend himself. I don't agree with what he did but I think he's entitled to some representation.

[Nodd]

It's not a witch-hunt.

I just thought I'd try and do the right thing by involving the community in the overall decision.

It's impossible to please everyone. Everytime I say or do anything I have atleast 1 person flaming me over it. All I know is that if someone finds extreme animal torture funny, I don't want anything to do with them.




EDIT: looking back in my messages archive, I recieved request for action on Lunicks'/Saladin's abusive behaviour.

Stuff like:

Hello mate.

Sorry to bother you, know your busy at the moment, but [username] and a few others are upset about saladins use of language of late. I dont think we should go overboard about this, saladin has always been a bit like this, but its not good for the forum.

Nodd,

Could you please do something about saladin's abusive language of late? Give him a warning or something. His language is one of the reasons why I don't enjoy reading the forums as much as I used to.

I'm sure other people find it disturbing as well, so if something can be done, that would be nice.

He has had many warnings from me in the past, so it's not as if I haven't given him numerous chances.

[Yali]

All I know is that if someone finds extreme animal torture funny, I don't want anything to do with them.

QFT

[IronBat]

As usualy everything I said is taken the wrong way *sigh*.

I was not aware that saladin had a inapproriate sig before, I am sorry that I had the wrong idea about that situation.

However I made it CLEAR I wasnt supporting what he did, I do NOT support animal cruelty, I SUPPORT the BAN, I was just asking for even handedness. I went to lengths to point out that I wasnt attacking anyone.

I am as dissapointed and unhappy about this situation as anyone, maybe I went a bit off topic by talking about saladin in general and that confused people.